♥ PosetteForever ♥

I also did not know that <img src="https://www.posetteforever.com/images/smiles/cussing.gif" alt="" /> didn't have Thilda and Andreas permission to use theirs stuff on his project. The RR staff would have to remove the chararcter from their free stuff area!

I think he will take out those morphs from the character and that's all.

I wish I knew which other head morphs are copyrighted too... I wouldn't like Nea2 to use them... <br /> <br /> I hope this goes well and everyone is happy at the end! <img src="https://www.posetteforever.com/images/smiles/wink.gif" alt="" />

<blockquote class="quote" cite="viewtopic.php?p=35448#p35448"><div class="quote-user">Tormie wrote: [<a href="#_somewhat" onclick="javascript:open_postreview('show_post.php?p=35448');" class="genmed">View Post</a>]</div><div class="post-text">I think he will take out those morphs from the character and that's all.</div></blockquote> <br /> <br /> I hope he would do it but until there they would have to remove the character with the MTs from their free stuff area.

Unless u have permission i would remove these morphs from the head: <br /> <br /> THe Lmouth morphs <br /> Linlin J <br /> Linlin wink R <br /> Linlinwink L <br /> Linlin blink R <br /> Linlin blink L <br /> Nene wink R3 <br /> Nenewink L3 <br /> Underlid R <br /> Underlid L <br /> eyebottom <br /> Alomondeye <br /> <br /> The morphs above have japanease creators and was offered as part of characters linlin and nene. <br /> <br /> <br /> Everything with a name, several of the name morphs belong to duane moody, other are from rendo free stuff. <br /> The klingon morph is ahjah's <br /> <br /> <br /> Lundernose - i recoginize it but don't know who the creator is. <br /> <br /> I think the remapp is a great idea. But i don't like the stealing of other ppl's creations. If he would have asked me, my reaction would have been very different. He would have been allowed to use all my morphs. But he choose to steal instead and therefore i don't want any of my stuff used in this. I wrote him a pm yesterday at rosity, and i have not gotten any reply - not in a pm, not in an email and not in the forum there.

All things with a name several of the name morphs belong to duane moody other are from rendo free stuff! I think I have been allowed to use all his or her morphs. Did they write back?

I recognized those morph too, I was remember that those are character names and removed them <img src="https://www.posetteforever.com/images/smiles/wink.gif" alt="" /> <br /> Also I have removed character morphs because I want to keep only the shaping morphs... <br /> <br /> I have to agree that request for permission or at least credit is the only thing someone that makes a freebie deserves! <br /> <br /> I wasn't asked for permission but in Nea's readme I think I say her morphs are distributable, however the readme doesn't mention Nea at all... <br /> Anyway I didn't think of it negative because it is something new for Posette and found this positive...

Rather than complex, the bottom line is simple. On the read me file it should have all the legal stuff attached to <br /> it. Permission is asked by the rightful owner of the morph to be used. When declined the person must stop all efforts to work the morph into the character. If the second party gives permission and it is a free project of the first party then he or she will be made notice a credit to the read me file of the rightful owner of the morph. A time frame should be put up of a reasonable time of one year for a person to come forward to dispute a claim of theirs to that morph or a part or whole of their work in general. From that time it is the second parties soul purpose to be made aware of such claims. After 1 year has past the second party if they have not contacted the first party of the said project will be removed from there rights because of the time of non-contact. All parties involved in order to make this legal will have to type a release of rights over to the first party from the date the permission was granted. <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> So how is that? <img src="https://www.posetteforever.com/images/smiles/wink.gif" alt="" />

Thank you Kenny <img src="https://www.posetteforever.com/images/smiles/notworthy.gif" alt="" /> . Pitklad and Kenny , I understand what you mean: on the balance, a new character is more important than some legal stuff. However, talking of Posetteforever, we were strict on our TOS even if it costed a lot, also in terms of losing very expert users. But, as I wrote on rosity, it's not a project shared here so we're not involved if not that the morphs, like Thilda's one, has been downloaded from here and they were covered by the GNU licence (as pangor rightly wrote), and if a friend here asks for help for defending his or her work, I'll help. I think that including thirdy party morphs without asking for permission is simply provocative: I can't think the author is so stupid, that's why I don't want PF to be involved, I smell that it was done on purpouse. If you think about it, it would be very simple to include in the readme a list of morphs (with the relative link) to be included in the package, things like "Import Pitklad's Nea Morph with morph manager for best results" <img src="https://www.posetteforever.com/images/smiles/eusa_think.gif" alt="" /> ... <br /> <br /> For what concerns me, simpathy or not for the author, for Posy <img src="https://www.posetteforever.com/images/smiles/heartbeat.gif" alt="" /> and in general for all my Posettes I use Arduino's Eve with quasi-standard textures that I make myself. It would be no difference for me for the shape of the texture because I make it myself. I don't make "all" myself, there are a lot of cut & paste but I don't share anything.

Interesting. Did they write back?

<img src="https://www.posetteforever.com/images/smiles/smile.gif" alt="" />

Hi, the gue remapping the posette has now removed my morph - don't know about the others. He also apologized in the forum and in a pm. <br /> So on my part the case is closed. <br /> <br /> I still think though that it is best to use one's own creations.... <img src="https://www.posetteforever.com/images/smiles/eusa_naughty.gif" alt="" />

<img src="https://www.posetteforever.com/images/smiles/ayeah.gif" alt="" /> <img src="https://www.posetteforever.com/images/smiles/ayeah.gif" alt="" /> <img src="https://www.posetteforever.com/images/smiles/ayeah.gif" alt="" />

I totally agree with that! <br /> That's why I made all Nea 1 morphs form scratch and I will be very carefull which morphs from PosetteV3 I'll include on Nea 2! <br /> <br /> I'm happy everything gone well and hope this makes anyone else in the future more careful! <img src="https://www.posetteforever.com/images/smiles/wink.gif" alt="" />

I am going to have to disagree with you Thilda. But we have known each other for a while now so I think I can say this. Ok, here goes. If everyone felt that they should use their own models, morphs and things then there would not be any Poser. True fact. Poser doesn't do it all and some people are not as knowledgeable with Poser and other software to get things done. Which comes to people like us. PitKlad, Ahjah, you and I not to mention countless others out there who help people. You can never judge this mishap as a forever thing. That would be unfair to others. What I am saying is things happen and people do make real honest mistakes. But the good in others always seems to shine. We can't just stop. It is in our nature to always pick it up and keep on going. So in a nut shell, no caring, no sharing means no nothing. Without a care, see how long and boring Poser would be without sharing and think of all before us that did share. Ok you can throw the rotten tomatoes now. <img src="https://www.posetteforever.com/images/smiles/wink.gif" alt="" />

Ok, maybe i should have written it better. It is best to use one's own models when sharing stuff. It is not ok to share stuff that you do not have permission to share. It is not ok to share other ppls's creations without asking them and it is not ok to go against a readme that says do not redistribute. <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> "You can never judge this mishap as a forever thing. That would be unfair to others. " <br /> I aggree that it is unfair to others. But this "mishap" It is not the first time someone has stolen something of mine and redistributed it, it is not the 2nd someone has done it or the 3rd, 4th, or the 5 time etc. It has happened several times. It is sad that someone chooses to ruin things for everyone else, but i am not to blame here, the thieves are. I don't choose to be unfair to the others, i choose to stand up for myself when someone is stealing from me. <br /> <br /> <br /> "What I am saying is things happen and people do make real honest mistakes." <br /> I don't think this was a mistake, i think he simply doesn't care. i think the only reason he backed off was because it was in his best intrest to do so, because the majority of the poser community thik it is wrong to steal. I think that he does know better and i know ppl have talked to him about copyright issues in the past when he has stolen from others and he didn't like it. <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> "We can't just stop. It is in our nature to always pick it up and keep on going. " <br /> Yes and as the creator it is my right to choose how i will pick things up and how i will keep going. <br /> <br /> <br /> "So in a nut shell, no caring, no sharing means no nothing. Without a care, see how long and boring poser would be without sharing and think of all before us that did share" <br /> I am actually amazed that you say that to me. if what you mean is: that if i don't share my creations with others, i don't care and if i don't share it means nothing. And that i should think about those before me who did share.. <br /> I do think about those before me who shared their creations and those who do it now. I think is wrong to steal from them too. I am grateful that there are ppl in the poser community who are genrous with their creativity and time and how chooses to share for the benefit of thoers. I have created freebies partly because of that, partly because of what i think of the whole selling thing and partly for my own private reasons. <br /> <br /> About the sharing and caring part, kenny you have 1 item in the freestuff here, i have 37. I also have 23 freebies on another site. I have one tut in two forums on different sites teaching ppl how to make their own morphs. I have spent many hours teaching ppl privately about poser and morphing through pm:s, emails and chatts. I have created stuff especially for ppl who have asked me and those items are not up in forums since they were personal gifts. <br /> I have never charge any money for anything when it comes to being creative and sharing. The last part of your post offends me, because i have shared a lot more than you and i have helpted ppl more than you. So you should not be teaching me about sharing or caring. <br /> <br /> <br /> For me, this mess was over and i was going and still is going to let it rest. I am asking everyone here to just let this thread die.

As an admin of the site I should not take a side but I'll point only some things: <br /> <br /> The line of Posetteforever is to observe the TOS and rules that we gave to us and that are the "philosophy" of the site : No porn pictures, no stuff on sale, no advertising of things made for making money. Looking at them, there is nothing wrong or illegal in doing those things, I mean porns, money etc. , but this site has its own line. We had big fights in the past about these things and lost users that didn't agree. I shared only a little, a couple of morphs but I would become VERY angry if someone would use them in his or her own character without asking me first. I agree with Thilda, that person simply didn't care of stealing, he violated our site, took things and used them without caring of the licence, and what happened ? Yes, we have that V3 but probably Thilda won't share her works anymore or she won't be happy to share them to the public. Someone can say that this V3 is more important than a morph, well, <u> this is not the right place for rankings </u> , here there are no gurus and we're all the same, we respect everyone and all the rankings are disabled on the whole site, so I care exactly the same for a little morph and for a complete character. The cost that Posetteforever pays is to have only few members, but it is the philosophy of the site, in return the link between us friends is very strong. I've to apologize to pangor to be a little rude for the message he wrote on rosity. He said the right things but I didn't want to spend the name of Posetteforever in this things preferring to help the authors like Thilda privately, but he was right and what is done is done. <br /> <br /> I'm very sad to see you quarrel my friends, I'm not a religious man but if I would be a priest I would have replied that the right answer is in the bible, and the bible in this case, are our TOS. i hope (but not sure) that things will go to normal (mess) soon.

My opinion on sharing stuff is, I do it for fun (and a little honour <img src="https://www.posetteforever.com/images/smiles/wink.gif" alt="" /> <img src="https://www.posetteforever.com/images/smiles/icon_redface.gif" alt="" /> ) <br /> As soon as I release a freebie, I'm aware it starts it's own life. <br /> It's a little like having children. They grow up and as parents you have to let them go their own way one day. You can't keep them under control and your care forever. Also, children don't turn out the way, their parents expect in most cases. We love them, anyway. <img src="https://www.posetteforever.com/images/smiles/wink.gif" alt="" /> <br /> Of course, I like to be asked before. Of course I love to be credited, but... <br /> I don't want to bother with this too much, cos, when I start bothering, the fun dis appears. <br /> So we should never forget, we do it for fun and happyness, my friends. Don't take it all too serious... <img src="https://www.posetteforever.com/images/smiles/lol.gif" alt="" /> <img src="https://www.posetteforever.com/images/smiles/TFR718 (6).gif" alt="" />

Thank you for sharing your opinion with me, ahjah. I will tell my botmaster. Kids are cool.

You're right Posy. Kids are the coolest <img src="https://www.posetteforever.com/images/smiles/heartbeat.gif" alt="" /> <img src="https://www.posetteforever.com/images/smiles/lol.gif" alt="" />

How many kids do you have?

I don't have any, yet, but my sister has got three <img src="https://www.posetteforever.com/images/smiles/smile.gif" alt="" />

I still think though that it is best to use one's own creations. Thilda you said that. As for anything that was meant for you <br /> was me saying that people that don't share their talents will leave Poser as a failure. Meaning the software will fail and not the people. <br /> That is the only thing I said for you. The rest was just an explanation of what could happen. The software doesn't back itself up. You have to buy things. To make maps you have to use a painter program. To use props you have to use modeling programs. That is all. This thing with you thinking all of this that I said it was all about you is you being mad for another persons wrongful doing and I got stuck in the cross fire of all of this. You attacked me about you sharing more than I do. I don't know this. I'm not on the internet <br /> when I do help people. See I knew when I tried to step in to smooth all this out, this is what I get. I get this all the time. Somebody takes it the wrong way and turns it into a negative when I was trying to be positive. I don't like all this crap with people getting into fights with things. But I do care for people. I thought I knew you Thilda. But you attack me with some of the things you said. Not sharing, well I'm going to say that hurt a bit. I'm sorry, I thought I knew you. But one thing is for sure , you don't know me. I do care about people and you have gone to far. <img src="https://www.posetteforever.com/images/smiles/very_sad.gif" alt="" /> <br /> <br /> <br /> I will stop sticking up for people as of now. This is way out of line. <img src="https://www.posetteforever.com/images/smiles/eusa_eh.gif" alt="" />

The general rule has been he creates a thing owns that thing. <br /> To own a thing is to control the thing. <br /> <br /> The matter is simple. TdaC created her morphs, she owns them. That is a fact and not an issue to be debated. <br /> From the moment they are created, items like the morphs the copyright law is in force, the owner is the only one with any rights involving them. The owner has all the rights to determine how the item will be used. If the owner wishes to, the item may be withheld, or sold, or offered for use gratis. But the person holding the copy of the item had no rights, only has the privliiage of doing with it as the owner permits. That is an axiom. <br /> <br /> TdaC had uploaded these item here for use by members, and they are licenced for use in renders (implied) they may not be given to another person in any form (clearly stated) they may not be used to create derivatives (clearly prohibited by the license not offering such priviliage). What remaining use is her offerings? for the use that she intended them to be used, as morphs for our renders. <br /> <br /> TdaC is not selfish to retain her ownership, she is generous to offer them to us as she has! We should be thankful to her, respectful of her wishes involving them, and <b>not make direct or indirect accusations of selfishness against her</b>. There is selfishness present, that being the selfishness of those who would demand more from her than she has offered. There is also selfishness of using her creations without permission, notification or attibution. By the law, what has been done by their use is a clear case of theft, the law has been broken. Now TdaC is once again being generous by not taking more firm measures including the envolovement of law enforcement, and she is here getting grief from her friends. <br /> <br /> There is a question expressed here about if the one who broke the law did so accidently or intentionally. Some say he did not know. Well the license in the archive he downloaded. In addition, from my personal experience and knowledge of the person who did it; it was most certainly an intentional act by someone who didn't care about proper ownership and is only interested in selfagrandizement, as the one man who saved posette. As he has posted many times. In addition, you will all recall last March (I hope you can recall it) when he was running ramppent through PF. Do any of you think, that I did not try to work with him about the issue of his misdeeds on the site. Do any of you think I did not discuss issues of copyrights with him? I told him and he intentionly reject that information in a rather vile way. His actions in this matter now is a continuation of his intentional rejection. Now that you know what you didn't know before it is settled, this is all factual, not open to debate. <br /> <br /> Now then, it had been said that this is a good thing for Posette. Is it? Are your memories that short? Or perhaps you were have not been around long enough to know what has gone one before. In that case listen to one who was around when it happened, personally experienced it, remembers it and will now tell you. <br /> <br /> As you will recall, I first became active again in 3D CGI during the last quarter of 2004 and that my history with it goes further back to the very beginning. <br /> <br /> On this site we have the project to help preserve and restore items for posette and fellow stock models. Why do we need to do it? Because they who created such items in the past were treated as TdaC has been in this incident. When did you begin in the 3D CGI and the Poser communities? I was a part of it all from the beginning. As soon as our computers could render images, in the early 1980s I was developing software to do that. Then in the 1990s came the initial release of Poser 2, the first version of direct use for creating finished works of art. A community soon grew around it, I was a part of that first Poser community. We had our online reposiories of Poser resources and our form of galleries, that community did not survive. It did not die on its own, it was killed by the selfish greed of people like he who stole from our dear TdaC and from the killing was assisted by the selfish greed of their apologists, defenders and protectors. I know that in my case as repository after repository died I came to the time when I chose to not seek a one through which to offer my free resources. So they faded from the memory of the art world. The same happened to all, then one day the last repository went offline and the last message was sent. The community was dead. How many who were active at that time still are? Not Poser 2 users, I mean those who were active contributing members of that first poser community. How many of those members are still here? As a certain fact, I know of only one, myself. <br /> <br /> Later a new Poser community grew, that was after the release of Poser 3. That second Poser community also died, and for the same reason. However, as it was dying out, it was overlapped by the birth of the current 3rd growth of the community. Many of those who were at that time still active switched over. but their once free item were no longer offered. It is those items that were lost due to the abuses, that we have the preservation project for. <br /> <br /> Go ahead and foolishly support a thief, then soon you will learn that a small development like Posette V3 is one of the the steps to loosing so much more. Consider the results of your actions and words for the long term. Let your reasoning and justice rule your heart; not you greed. Those who aid, defend and/or support him are equal to him in my eyes for they like him have chosen to by the darkness. <br /> <br /> If any of this seems hard and cold, imagine how TdaC feels to have her friends turn against her for the sake of thief so that they can <br /> <br /> TdaC, I have benefited from your generosity and your creativity. Thank you.

It's better to close this topic friends.