Answer 5:
You usually don't need a separate actor (group) for the brake calipers, since the calipers won't move in the car figure. Therefore, the calipers are part of the carbody, and the wheels are a separate actor.

If your car object has separate caliper groups, include the caliper geometries into the carbody group, and delete the caliper groups:
1. Open Group Editor.
2. Select the carbody group in the Group Editor.
3. Click "Include Group" and select a caliper group.
4. Repeat for all caliper groups.
5. Select a caliper group in the Group Editor. Click "Delete Group". Repeat for all caliper groups.

Caution: Don't delete the wrong group by mistake. And don't forget to delete the caliper groups, otherwise you have two groups including the same geometry. Before you spawn the props, check "Show Multigrouped Faces" in the Group Editor. Poser highlights all faces which are members of more than one group. When you spawn props from an object with multigrouped faces, you get a duplicate of the same geometry. For example, the caliper geometry is included in the carbody part and in the caliper part.

If your car has a moveable suspension, you group the caliper geometry with the part where the caliper is attached. Of course, the geometry of the suspension should be mechanically consistent. This means, there must be some geometry where the caliper is attached (usually the housing of the bearing).

When you have different parts which should roll with the wheel, you choose a common parent for all rotating parts. For example, you have an actor "axleFL". When you rotate the wheel, you set exactly one rotate channel of actor "axleFL". All actors which should follow the rotation are children of actor "axleFL". The hierarchy could look like this:
2 axleFL
3 brakerotorFL
3 rimFL
4 spinnerFL
4 tireFL

Now when you rotate "axleFL" all children follow the rotation, that is the brake rotor and the
rim and the children of the rim.
            
Usually you don't need a separate tire actor, unless you want to move the tire away from the rim in your car figure. Therefore, you group the rim and the tire and make a single actor "wheel".

The car I've chosen doesn't have a suspension, or axle group.

The way I understand it is: the  front rotors, and calipers need to steer with wheels & tires; and the rotors need to roll (x- rotate?) with wheels & tires.

So, in this situation, what would you suggest to prevent the front calipers from rolling with the wheel/tire/rotor group?

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It's not what you look like, when you're doing what you're doing;
It's what you're doing, when you're doing what it looks like you're doing.

I thought I should post this image for P5 or newer users following this thread.

{I left the roof panels in seperate groups because I wanted to be able to make them invisible when desired. I left the spoiler a seperate group; because it's height is adjusted as the vehicle increases speed. I left the engine part in their original groups; because I was unsure of the detail accuracy, and may want to change them in the future.)

Question 6:
Is it nessesary to put something in the phi file to change the spoiler height; or is it ok to just use the y-trans dial?

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It's not what you look like, when you're doing what you're doing;
It's what you're doing, when you're doing what it looks like you're doing.

You're right. You need two separate actors to steer and drive.  

You could try the following rig for the front wheel:

2 caliper
3 brakerotor
4 wheel

Use the y-rotate on parent "caliper" to steer. Use the x-rotate on child "brakerotor" to drive. When you steer, the caliper and its children follow the rotation. When you drive, the caliper is fixed. The brakerotor rotates and its child "wheel" follows the rotation (see image).

Answer 6:
No need to modify the phi. You can use the y-tran dial on the spoiler actor.

Poser includes translate channels for each actor in the new cr2, but the translate dials are by default hidden (except for the dials on the root actor). When you want to use translate dials in a child actor, you have to open the cr2 in a text editor and edit the "hidden" line in each translate channel you want to access in the dials palette. "hidden 0" display a dial for the channel, "hidden 1" doesn't.

BTW, your car looks great.

Thanks VK!


That is a clever solution to my rotor problem.

I might have more questions about the joints. I now have the bones in place.; but I am not having the expected results when adjusting the position.

But; now I need sleep.

Thanks again.

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It's not what you look like, when you're doing what you're doing;
It's what you're doing, when you're doing what it looks like you're doing.

{I forgot to say, that the car model is not created by me; I just chose it to learn rigging in Poser.}

It seems as if the "crosshairs" are in the reverse order from those shown in VK's diagrams. {I mean, the green one is at the rear edge of the door, and the red one is at the front edge.} Is this caused by the model originally facing rearward?

I positioned the "crosshairs" in the Left door to match the diagrams; but when I apply rotation the whole front part of the car bends. I'm unclear about how to control only the desired actor.

also, the bones seem to be in an incorrect position. The main bone seems to be located near the Right front wheel.

{see image.}

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It's not what you look like, when you're doing what you're doing;
It's what you're doing, when you're doing what it looks like you're doing.

A. The reversed door-joint:
This could be caused by the orientation of the geometry. Poser assumes the new figure is facing the front camera which is the default for all Poser humans and animals.

On the other hand, my simple example car has correct orientations for the door when I have a facing front and a facing back model and create the figure using the same phi-file. It's maybe just a fluke, who knows.

Of course, you can always correct the joint orientation in the Joint Editor.

B. Front part bending:
You have to disable (uncheck) the "Bend" option of all actors:
1. Select an actor.
2. Open the Info dialog.
3. Uncheck "Bend".
The Bend option activates the soft-body joint attributes. These attributes define which polygons should be deformed when you bend (rotate) the actor of a skin (an organic figure). Cars are not skins and the joints shouldn't deform the geometry. Therefore you have to uncheck the Bend option. (You should also delete the respective channels in the cr2).


C. Origin of the root actor:
I'm not sure whether I understand the bones in your picture. The base of the cone is the origin, the top is the endpoint, right? The large bone from the center to the right front wheel seems to be the origin and endpoint of the root actor "carbody".

It looks like Poser places the endpoint of actor "carbody" at the origin of the first child (the front wheel on the right "RIMRF" according to the Hierarchy Editor shown). From there, Poser draws a line to the origin of the following children. This would explain the white lines originating at RIMRF and ending at the origin of the remaining children.

In a car model you usually only need the origin, not the endpoint, of an actor. The origins look OK as far as I can see.

To fix the endpoint problem (if this is a problem), you could place the endpoint of actor "carbody" at the center of the car, right above the origin of "carbody" (same xz-coordinates of origin and endpoint).

I don't know if you can edit the endpoints in Poser 5. The Joint Editor of Poser 4 only shows the endpoint of the "goals" (the last children in the hierarchy). To modify the endpoint (in Poser 4), you have to edit the cr2 in a text editor:
1. Open the cr2 in a text editor.
2. Find the code of actor "carbody". The code could look like this:


3. Scroll down to the end of this actor's code. It looks like this:


4. Edit the "endpoint" line. There are 3 numbers separated by a space. The numbers are the xyz-coordinates of the endpoint. Write the xz-values from the "origin" line into the xz-values of the "endpoint" line. Save and close.

As far as I can see, the cr2 should work well. If you modify the endpoint of "carbody", post a new picture with the resulting bones. If you get unexpected results with the cr2, post the problems.

In Poser5 the endpoints are controllable with the joint editor. I'll change their positions to match the origins' positions. {I'd done this with the Left door; but the body still bent; so I changed it back. Now that you've explained the bending issue to me, I'll redo it.}

Thanks again VK!

 

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It's not what you look like, when you're doing what you're doing;
It's what you're doing, when you're doing what it looks like you're doing.

The cr2 is almost complete.

Just a few things...:

The endpoints are not a problem, after bend is unchecked for each part.

I have been unable to unhide the ytrans dial for the spoiler. I changed the "hidden" from 1 to 0; no success. I then noticed that there were fewer lines in the "groupNode Transform" section; so I added the missing ones to the c2. I again changed the "hidden" value; no success.
Suggestions?

Also... How do I set limits for the dials? {I mean, so the doors & hood will open only so far...}

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It's not what you look like, when you're doing what you're doing;
It's what you're doing, when you're doing what it looks like you're doing.

A. Dial limits:
In the channel code, there is a "min" and a "max" line, like



1. Write your min and max values into the channel code. The minimum value must be smaller than or equal to the maximum value. When your door opens to -80 degrees, you choose
min -80
max 0

When the values are equal or the max value is smaller than min, the dial is locked.

2. Write the "forceLimits 4" flag. The default value 0 means the limits are by default disabled. The dial can take any value unless the user activates "Figure > Use Limits". When the "Use Limits" menu is activated, the dial takes only values within the "min" and "max" limits in the channel code.

A "forceLimits" value other than 0 means the "min" and "max" limits in the channel code are always enabled. The user cannot choose a value beyond the limits. This is what you want.


B. Y-tran dial invisible:
I'm not sure what the problem is. Could you post the code of the "groupNode Transform"? Are there any IK-chains in the model? IK-chains, if available, are listed in the Hierarchy Editor. Delete all of them.

Save a document with the model and open the document in a text editor. Is the y-tran channel in the code? Is the "hidden 0" line set?

You can send me the cr2 code (without geometry, maps, etc.) so I can take a look at it.

Ah... I forgot about Figure->Force Limits. Limits work now; thanks.


I attached the cr2. I left in the modifcations that I made to the groupNode code; because I was sucsessfl in removing the "taper dial" from the spoiler with it.

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It's not what you look like, when you're doing what you're doing;
It's what you're doing, when you're doing what it looks like you're doing.

I could run the cr2 in Poser 4 with an example geometry (some cubes). The yTran dial of the spoiler is available
and works as expected. Poser 4 strips some of the script when the model loads, but the essential channel code
is the same as the code used by Poser 5.

The "groupNode" is only used to group dials in the tabs of the dials palette, AFAIK. This parameter does not
affect the channels. It seems as if you have to list the channels in a groupNode when you want to see the dials.
Anyway, the yTran channel was already listed in the groupNode of actor SPOILER.

I noticed a "SPOILER_jointx" dial on actor "Carbody". Channel "jointX SPOILER_jointx" is usually invisible
(and should be automatically hidden when you open and close the Joint Editor with selected "Carbody"). However,
this shouldn't affect the channels of the spoiler.

I attach a zip with 3 different cr2's you can test:

carreratest1.cr2:
This is basically your original cr2. The only difference is a hidden "jointX SPOILER_jointx" channel on actor
"Carbody". The yTran dial on actor "SPOILER" should be available in the dials palette of the spoiler.

carreratestPo4.cr2:
This is the original cr2 loaded and saved in Poser 4. I used this cr2 for my test. The yTran dial on actor
"SPOILER" is available in the dials palette and works as expected. Note that the "figureResFile" lines point at
:Runtime:Geometries:carrera.obj. And the materials are Poser 4 style, of course. Poser 4 doesn't use the
groupNode code. If all fails, try this cr2.

carreratestStrip.cr2:
The stripped version of your cr2. I removed the unused code.
There are several channels in each actor used only for joint and geometry deformation: "twistX", "jointY",
"smoothScaleZ" etc. and "taper". These channels bloat the cr2 and are dead code (never used).
There are "weld" commands for each parent and child. "Weld" glues the seams of parents and children. This is
only used when you have a skin with a continuous surface. Car actors are usually not welded, and the code can
be removed. The filesize of the stripped cr2 is about 10% smaller. The more actors you have, the more
overhead you get. The overhead is duplicated in each document which includes the figure.

Thanks VK.

I intended to remove the bloat; but wanted to get the cr2 working well first.


I'll try out the cr2s and get back to you.

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It's not what you look like, when you're doing what you're doing;
It's what you're doing, when you're doing what it looks like you're doing.

*stomp* I want this Porsche

____________

To VK;

I loaded the "carrerateststrip.cr2", directed it to the correct obj, and everything works well.      
Thank you very much for assistance with this!  

I do have a couple more questions though...

1.) Would there be a great size benefit to removing all of the unused dials(scaling for children, zrotate for wheels,...) from the cr2?

2.) Could you please explain the much smaller cr2 size of the P4 version?

{I intend to look into & compare the different versions; but I'm being invaded by friends from out of town. It must be "Spring Break" somewhere in the world... }


To Ahjah;

I'm glad that I excepted this and the other Hankster automobiles as perks from one of my "testing jobs". I almost didn't; because they were not "poserized"; Now, thanks to VK's tutorial, and assistance... they are (or will be...).  



To Goat;

If you've been lurking this thread recently, I'm curious to know how your progress is going.  

I decided that I don't use much Poser animation, so I did not include poseable pedals, and I did not link the turning of the steering wheel to the steering of the tires. I think I will include those with the next auto I poserize; but now I want to spend some time getting aquainted with Apollo Maximus, and Miki 2.

____________
It's not what you look like, when you're doing what you're doing;
It's what you're doing, when you're doing what it looks like you're doing.